Im getting a 206 lol =]

mums payin my insurance so i dont need to worry about that and shes paying half for the car

Tuvra wrote:

You have to drive the new "face lift" Cooper S to make those kind of comments Very Impressive car, the missus has one......

Simple physics dictates you will still never beat a RWD or a AWD car for ability to put the power down, hence my comments. Besides, I prefer have a set of wheels that drive, and a set that steer.

.simon wrote:

I don't think anyone will argue with that. In an ideal world all cars would be awd/rwd.

But you dont need awd/rwd to have a fun car: Integra Type R DC2? DC5? Civic Type R FD2? Clio Williams? Clio 172 Cup? Megane R26.R? Focus RS Mk2? 205 GTi? 106 Rallye/GTi? etc. Many of those can and will show up more expensive rwd/awd cars on tracks that reward driving ability rather than ability to just nail your right foot.

I'm as bored of 'Ring willy waving laptimes as most people, but I think its quite an achievement for the Megane R26R to lap it faster than an E46 M3 and a Porsche Cayman, the new Focus RS will be even faster I bet.

I dont doubt that for a second, but after having some luke warm and driving some hot fwd cars I found myself firmly in the loathe camp.

Although i've still to try a teg.

Steam wrote:

I dont doubt that for a second, but after having some luke warm and driving some hot fwd cars I found myself firmly in the loathe camp.

Although i've still to try a teg.

Yeah. can fully understand where you're coming from. Pretty sure you've had a supra or something before, so I can see why fwd cars wouldnt feel as good to drive in comparison, and in the wet theyre definetely not much fun with trying to put power down/understeer etc.

Ashz wrote:

and im just happy having a car which has a mpg higher than my bhp

haha. I kinda miss driving my mum's C1 for economy reasons. The fuel bars never move on it Although surprisingly not found my ST much worse economy-wise than my old C2 GT (except around town). But that definetely wasnt gettin the claimed 40mpg.

Typhoon2000 wrote:

True comment - the only problem is that with cars that cover the whole range from base to sport - you're still pretty limited by the base model in the first place - bear in mind that because of this, the 'family' of the same car will always be built to cost.

As for the physics - yes you are right - There will always be a degree of instability with lift-off oversteer or torque steer under heavy acceleration - and without the electronics to help out then power of 200hp would probable be the limit. One thing to note, the best type of suspension for FWD will always be double wishbone independent front suspension - however it IS costly.

Ford has managed to get around the problems I have mentioned above by trying to re-engineer with orginal set up be altering the kingpin geometry, the geomtry and positioning of the strut and the TCA set up.

Simon, I think you would be highly interested in this set up from Morego ... How does a 350hp Focus ST grab ya?

It's almost similar to what Ford has done, however, I'm not entirely sure what type of diff the ST is running (from stock) - However, the suspension system should be enough to instill confidence out of the bends...

Edit: the Morego ST seems to feature a quaife diff similar to the RS. Also, these figures were achieved without a cam-swap. 400hp is fully achievable..

I agree completely. I'd say the Integra Type R is one of the few fwd cars completely designed for its intended purpose, rather than a shopping car that's been modified to be sporty. fwd certainly has its limitations, certainly in bad conditions, although I never really push myself on a public road that far, i'd only do that on track.

Interesting read that, thanks for linking it. Does look a nice bit of kit. 0-100 quicker than a Vantage V8 I'll most likely go for remap, intercooler, cais, sport-cat/down-pipe, should be good for around 290bhp/320lb.ft at that point. Anything more starts to cost a fair whack more so will have to see how the car goes The thought of the 400bhp+ conversion with the cams/uprated internals sounds appealing though

i got a c2 off my mummy and daddy for xmas so i didnt get to choose mine

xx